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No, I won't read your fucking story.
Do I have your attention, LOL?
Inspired by a post from![[livejournal.com profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/external/lj-userinfo.gif)
minerva_one, who ganked it from cleolinda, let's take a look at why screenwriter Josh Olson has declared I Will Not Read Your Fucking Script.
Please make sure you at least read the original article before continuing.
Frankly, I am firmly in both Olson andcleolinda's camps. Most people that approach professional writers in whatever field with pieces of their epic master works *are* just looking for glorified pats on the back. They don't want to hear the truth about their work, or the fact that their writer friends can't get them an 'in' with their agent/publisher/whatever. I mean, WTF? How do these people think those writers got their jobs in the first place? Of all the possible professions on the planet, I think writing is probably the one that benefits the LEAST from networking. Its a very solitary job, in more aspects than one.
As tocleolinda's dilemma, which minerva_one touches on in her post...well, the way I see it, we fanfic writers face the same conundrum. Though I've never received such, quite a few people in fandom have gotten the sort of "I love your story will you read and review AND RLY RLY CRIT mine? Here's the link OMGTHANX" non-review on a piece they've posted. Besides being fucking annoying (and disrespectful, especially when its obvious said reviewer didn't actually read your fic), its also treading into dangerous territory. How many wars have erupted in fandom over the "stealing of ideas"?
But wait, you protest. This is fanfic we're writing - we're already stealing ideas, from the original source material. After all, isn't that like the biggest criticism fanwriters face? ("Why can't/don't you write original stuff instead? Are you LAZY, or just unwilling?") I'd argue - no, its not. At least in IY fandom, there are a million different ways to "continue" the canon story, or endless possibilities for AUs. I understand we have a different level of acceptance from other fandoms, especially of the latter. I dabble quite a bit in AUs myself, not because I'm not interested in the original canon, but because I am really enjoying the core characteristics of the main cast, and would like to see how they fare in a different setting, most usually modern.
Anyway - when you write an AU, the idea is most generally original: the setting, the plot, sometimes even the pairings. Yes, we have tropes (*groan* geez, do we ever!) but everyone worth their salt at least attempts to put an original spin on it. I think anyone would be upset if they found someone 'stealing' their idea - I know I was, at the first inkling that someone would rip off all the world-building I'd done for something that sounded completely inane. And, IMO, that would be justifiable.
But - getting back to the heart ofcleolinda's comment - I wonder how much people realize they are influenced by what they read, watch, or listen to. I know I'm extremely paranoid about 'sub-conscious plagiarism', and thus, I tend to read very little in comparison to my output as a fanfic writer. One of the reasons I *am* so paranoid is because I can see the reflection of other multimedia in my work - what I've been watching, for example - that isn't always intentional.
To me, its not quite as big a deal when fanfic is the medium I'm working in. Style is flexible, and generally the stories rewarded with reviews, hits, and awards are those that stick very close to the norm for either canon or fanon. Clever little in-jokes, or bringing in something from another popular show, is something astute readers can get real kicks out of, and is something that can help boost the popularity of a fic or author. And besides, sometimes its intentional - I know different types of music lead to different types of fic (I listen to DMB for sex scenes, and Rage Against the Machine when I'm jonesing for some action/adventure), and I really enjoy writing straight-out songfic. I tend to immerse myself in investigative or true crime shows when I'm writing darkfic. I know the source of my research material when I'm aiming for a certain outcome.
And that? To me, that's fine. After all, what do writers do, other than redirect one type of media into another?
But when it comes to reading...I'm a bit tougher on myself.
I don't ever want to be put in the position of, "you stole my idea!" I'd never intentionally do that. Hell, I feel skeezy writing fic that's too close to the manga or anime (as in, lifting dialogue or particular action sequences). I've read my share of amazing fic, and if I know I got a certain bit from a fic, I'm going to credit that fic from here to eternity - like I did when lifting the title "House of the Moon" from Resmiranda's Tales from the House of the Moon in my Every Heart fic.
What I'm afraid of is not realizing that I've lifted something from someone else's work. Lines of dialogue especially stick with me (as anybody with an affinity for Grey's Anatomy who read the latest chapter of Fleeting can readily attest), though sometimes particularly impressive stylistic choices can as well.
So - I've found that I tend to read material by authors who have very different ideas and styles from mine (generally, writers I find on par with or better than my own material). For example - its neat to have the mind-meld withpsyco_chick32, but we tend to play with different characters - -who would, in turn, react in different ways to the same situation, and thus our fics would probably have wildly different outcomes even if they started from the same place.
Its a delicate balance, you know? Reading enough to know what's well-established and popular, but not reading so much that you're subconsciously lifting a style, or idea, or line of dialogue from someone else.
Fandom has a culture of shared ideas, so to some extent, its more acceptable for fanwork to maybe not be as original as original/professional fiction. I know I approach the two different situations completely differently. I don't have my fanfic beta'ed (GASP HORROR), but if I ever gathered up the nerve to send off original fiction for publication, I'd at least have a second pair of eyes look at it first...eyes I trusted implicitly, as there's a HUGE deal with passing around unpublished fiction and the ability you have to protect your intellectual property.
So in the midst of all my rambles, I'm asking my f-list a very general set of questions: how much do you read fanfiction, outside your own work and/or circle of friends? Do you tend to favor work that is very much like yours (in pairing, genre, tropes/cliches used), or do you find yourself reading work by someone who writes something outside your comfort zone? How much do you fear subconscious plagiarism, if at all? Are you even aware of how much your perception of the media around you influences your work? Do you care?
Inspired by a post from
minerva_one, who ganked it from cleolinda, let's take a look at why screenwriter Josh Olson has declared I Will Not Read Your Fucking Script.Please make sure you at least read the original article before continuing.
Frankly, I am firmly in both Olson and
cleolinda's camps. Most people that approach professional writers in whatever field with pieces of their epic master works *are* just looking for glorified pats on the back. They don't want to hear the truth about their work, or the fact that their writer friends can't get them an 'in' with their agent/publisher/whatever. I mean, WTF? How do these people think those writers got their jobs in the first place? Of all the possible professions on the planet, I think writing is probably the one that benefits the LEAST from networking. Its a very solitary job, in more aspects than one.As to
cleolinda's dilemma, which minerva_one touches on in her post...well, the way I see it, we fanfic writers face the same conundrum. Though I've never received such, quite a few people in fandom have gotten the sort of "I love your story will you read and review AND RLY RLY CRIT mine? Here's the link OMGTHANX" non-review on a piece they've posted. Besides being fucking annoying (and disrespectful, especially when its obvious said reviewer didn't actually read your fic), its also treading into dangerous territory. How many wars have erupted in fandom over the "stealing of ideas"?But wait, you protest. This is fanfic we're writing - we're already stealing ideas, from the original source material. After all, isn't that like the biggest criticism fanwriters face? ("Why can't/don't you write original stuff instead? Are you LAZY, or just unwilling?") I'd argue - no, its not. At least in IY fandom, there are a million different ways to "continue" the canon story, or endless possibilities for AUs. I understand we have a different level of acceptance from other fandoms, especially of the latter. I dabble quite a bit in AUs myself, not because I'm not interested in the original canon, but because I am really enjoying the core characteristics of the main cast, and would like to see how they fare in a different setting, most usually modern.
Anyway - when you write an AU, the idea is most generally original: the setting, the plot, sometimes even the pairings. Yes, we have tropes (*groan* geez, do we ever!) but everyone worth their salt at least attempts to put an original spin on it. I think anyone would be upset if they found someone 'stealing' their idea - I know I was, at the first inkling that someone would rip off all the world-building I'd done for something that sounded completely inane. And, IMO, that would be justifiable.
But - getting back to the heart of
cleolinda's comment - I wonder how much people realize they are influenced by what they read, watch, or listen to. I know I'm extremely paranoid about 'sub-conscious plagiarism', and thus, I tend to read very little in comparison to my output as a fanfic writer. One of the reasons I *am* so paranoid is because I can see the reflection of other multimedia in my work - what I've been watching, for example - that isn't always intentional.To me, its not quite as big a deal when fanfic is the medium I'm working in. Style is flexible, and generally the stories rewarded with reviews, hits, and awards are those that stick very close to the norm for either canon or fanon. Clever little in-jokes, or bringing in something from another popular show, is something astute readers can get real kicks out of, and is something that can help boost the popularity of a fic or author. And besides, sometimes its intentional - I know different types of music lead to different types of fic (I listen to DMB for sex scenes, and Rage Against the Machine when I'm jonesing for some action/adventure), and I really enjoy writing straight-out songfic. I tend to immerse myself in investigative or true crime shows when I'm writing darkfic. I know the source of my research material when I'm aiming for a certain outcome.
And that? To me, that's fine. After all, what do writers do, other than redirect one type of media into another?
But when it comes to reading...I'm a bit tougher on myself.
I don't ever want to be put in the position of, "you stole my idea!" I'd never intentionally do that. Hell, I feel skeezy writing fic that's too close to the manga or anime (as in, lifting dialogue or particular action sequences). I've read my share of amazing fic, and if I know I got a certain bit from a fic, I'm going to credit that fic from here to eternity - like I did when lifting the title "House of the Moon" from Resmiranda's Tales from the House of the Moon in my Every Heart fic.
What I'm afraid of is not realizing that I've lifted something from someone else's work. Lines of dialogue especially stick with me (as anybody with an affinity for Grey's Anatomy who read the latest chapter of Fleeting can readily attest), though sometimes particularly impressive stylistic choices can as well.
So - I've found that I tend to read material by authors who have very different ideas and styles from mine (generally, writers I find on par with or better than my own material). For example - its neat to have the mind-meld with
psyco_chick32, but we tend to play with different characters - -who would, in turn, react in different ways to the same situation, and thus our fics would probably have wildly different outcomes even if they started from the same place. Its a delicate balance, you know? Reading enough to know what's well-established and popular, but not reading so much that you're subconsciously lifting a style, or idea, or line of dialogue from someone else.
Fandom has a culture of shared ideas, so to some extent, its more acceptable for fanwork to maybe not be as original as original/professional fiction. I know I approach the two different situations completely differently. I don't have my fanfic beta'ed (GASP HORROR), but if I ever gathered up the nerve to send off original fiction for publication, I'd at least have a second pair of eyes look at it first...eyes I trusted implicitly, as there's a HUGE deal with passing around unpublished fiction and the ability you have to protect your intellectual property.
So in the midst of all my rambles, I'm asking my f-list a very general set of questions: how much do you read fanfiction, outside your own work and/or circle of friends? Do you tend to favor work that is very much like yours (in pairing, genre, tropes/cliches used), or do you find yourself reading work by someone who writes something outside your comfort zone? How much do you fear subconscious plagiarism, if at all? Are you even aware of how much your perception of the media around you influences your work? Do you care?
no subject
I had just written 2 fics, one where InuYasha indeed wants to go home and not wait for Miroku after his first trip out of town with him after Kagome's experience in "Future Legend." And the second fic was his return, early in the morning.
The writer of the songfic is one of my regular readers. She created a little songfic where shortly after they were married, Inu's out with Miroku and is too ansty to wait for him and Miroku gives him his blessing for him to return home, and he finds Kagome collecting herbs in the field and they have a grand happy reunion moment.
She wrote this after reading my two pieces. They're different enough that I could consider them derivative in an acceptable way, modelled a bit after my scenario, but not crossing the line. Her reunion scene was way different, it was a songfic; and the idea is probably common enough, except that I knew she had read my stories. I was actually kind of pleased that she may have modelled on me, but kept it her own, and that maybe I'm starting to have a little effect on the post manga fanon. That would be kind of cool. I know my having InuYasha build a house while Kagome was gone has popped up in more than one post-manga fic.
You and me, we like the meta stuff, that's for sure.
no subject
LOL, that would be pretty awesome :) Sometimes I wonder how much Resmiranda cares about people using the 'House of the Moon' title from her fic. Hell, her fic has been examined in actual college courses, how crazy is that?!
After I read it, I emailed her and was like, "You could totally turn this original and sell it!" because I felt her writing and her ideas were just that good - and by the end, had deviated enough from the IY canon at the time to make it plausible.
But, yeah. It's pretty rad to be a trendsetter!! =)
You and me, we like the meta stuff, that's for sure.
Its nice having people to discuss it with, most of all! Nothing like the exchange of ideas to touch off some interesting fanworks :)
(All the while, I have this Totosai + Sess piece in mind for the next installment of Allegiance...trying to figure out some good research material to hit up, besides canon, to tweak Totosai into just the right form...I suspect the muses will be raring to go on that tomorrow!)
no subject
Really? Tell me more about this. Fanfiction as the new "mythology' and folklore of the masses fascinates me.